MwtM Matt Mazzuckelli v1 Audio Only
[Speaker 2]
Hey Matt, welcome to Medicine with the Metals. I’d like to go ahead and introduce you to our audience today. You know, tell us a little bit about yourself, who you are, what interests you in this whole mushroom space, and we’ll let you start.
[Speaker 1]
My name is Matt Mazzucchelli. For about the past decade, I’ve been running a business focused on mushrooms. It started with foraging and cultivating culinary mushrooms, but I pretty quickly got interested in the medicinal side of things.
A lot of my main interest started with Lion’s Mane after a car accident that I was in in 2015. And from there, once I started learning about everything that was possible, I’d had a chance to study a little bit with Rick Doblin when I was much younger, when I was about 19 or 20. And he certainly introduced me to the concept of the psilocybin mushrooms in medicine, and that was always in the back of my mind.
And then once I learned about things like Lion’s Mane, Reishi, Chaga, Cordyceps, a lot of the functionals that y’all have been working with, it really just, I knew that was my path. And so as I’ve been in herbal at school and learned different formulations and had a chance to speak clients and a client-facing practice, it’s really just that’s where my interest and my passion is, is in mushrooms as medicine.
[Speaker 2]
So, you know, today let’s just dive into, because we love our psilocybin mushrooms, Matt, but, you know, let’s really focus today on these functionals, you know, because you said something about Lion’s Mane. That’s a really popular mushroom amongst the Western world right now. So let’s dive into a little bit of these mushrooms, each and every one of them.
Let’s talk about Lion’s Mane and the benefits of what Lion’s Mane is.
[Speaker 1]
Primarily the benefits you see with Lion’s Mane are around the brain and nerves. There’s a lot that happens when we get Lion’s Mane into our systems. One of the big things is its ability to help increase the levels of the chemical that our new nerves are made from, or that’s used to repair nerves.
It can help to establish or re-establish the myelin, the protective sheath on damaged nerves. So one of the terms that I think Paul Stamets may have coined or has used a lot is neurogenesis, which is the ability to either create new nerve cells or repair damaged nerves. And what a lot of people report when they use it is a lot of clarity, a lot of focus, an increased sense of calm without feeling like they’re sedate or anything like that.
So as people age, or in my case, what really got me interested in it was the brain fog from anesthesia after a really long surgery from the injury that I had. And just thinking about how much more clear my mind was before I had that experience. And once I learned that Lion’s Mane, that was something that could potentially lift that brain fog and get those nerves working again, that was kind of a light bulb moment for me.
And it’s really not even limited to the nerves in your brain. If there’s been nerves that are injured or damaged in other parts of your body, Lion’s Mane can really help with that too.
[Speaker 2]
Pretty amazing. This is really an amazing mushroom, amazing fungi. And then we can go on to cordyceps.
I mean, we could talk Lion’s Mane forever because Lion’s Mane and psilocybin go very well hand in hand together too. It’s one of those classic, wake up that mind, that brain fog like you’re talking about. It really is.
It’s so important. I think it’s important to use both of those together. If you’re microdosing a small dose of 200, maybe 300 milligrams of psilocybin, then you’re 500 milligrams of Lion’s Mane.
So let’s talk a little bit about cordyceps. Cordyceps is another one of those popular fungi. And the benefits are amazing with cordyceps.
[Speaker 1]
Without a doubt. Like a lot of mushrooms, it’s got the, I guess what most people would consider the medicinal qualities related to the immune system, what they call the immunomodulation. So what’s cool about mushrooms is they don’t really suppress or boost your immune system.
They modulate it. So it works at the right level. What’s the difference there?
[Speaker 2]
What is that difference? Explain to our people out there. What is modulating?
[Speaker 1]
I guess it means that it helps your immune system find that sweet spot. Instead of something that’s just going to take you in one direction or the other, either to suppress it if it’s too active or to boost it if it’s not active enough. A lot of the mushrooms are what they call the immunomodulators, meaning it’ll help you find the sweet spot, the right place where your immune system needs to be, rather than just taking it in one direction or the other, if that makes any sense.
Yeah, for sure. For sure.
[Speaker 2]
So sorry to interrupt you, but cordyceps, let’s talk a little bit more.
[Speaker 1]
No, no worries. The immune activity of cordyceps is some of the strongest. It’s one of the ones they look at when they’re dealing with viruses that are on the order of HIV.
It’s really great for things like adrenal fatigue or any adrenal sort of issues. It tends to boost testosterone in a lot of people that take it. So there’s a lot of athletes that like it for that reason, but I’ve also seen it used with a lot of people that are dealing with the various stages of menopause to help offset some of the symptoms of that because it can provide that testosterone boost.
So that’s a really kind of cool thing about cordyceps too.
[Speaker 2]
What do you think dosage-wise for this mushroom? You think that 500 milligram or above?
[Speaker 1]
It really depends. Some people can be a little more sensitive to cordyceps, so the starting dose may be a little lower just so you can see how it affects you. I’ve seen more sensitivity to it with females or female presenting people than I have with males or male presenting people just because of the potential effect on the testosterone, but it tends to be generally pretty well tolerated by most people that take it.
[Speaker 2]
Well, let’s talk. We’re going to talk about all of them, but we’re going to just dive into a few of these right now. Let’s talk a little bit about chaga.
Chaga? Chaga. Chaga.
[Speaker 1]
Super interesting because first of all, the chaga itself, it doesn’t look like a typical mushroom that you would think of or a typical fungus. A lot of times people will confuse it for a burl or something just because it’s this black outer coated brown interior chunk that grows off the side of a birch tree, but it is actually what will produce the reproductive fruiting bodies and spread the chaga to the other birch trees. Is it only birch trees?
It’s almost exclusive to birch trees. There are some places where you can find chaga that grows on elm trees, but because it grows on elm and not on birch, it lacks the medicinal compounds that are present in the stuff that grows on birch. The Latin name for the birch trees, the genus that the birch trees are in is betulina, and a lot of the active compounds in chaga and a couple of the other birch exclusive medicinal mushrooms are the betulins or betulinic acids, and those simply aren’t present in the elm trees, so they’re not present in the chaga that would grow on the elms.
Isn’t that just wild how nature works like that?
[Speaker 2]
It’s pretty crazy. It really is when you’re explaining it. I’m like, how did that mushroom know that tree?
But that’s just how the world of plants is. They’re way smarter than we are. And they’ve been doing it a lot longer than we have, too.
A lot longer. They just can’t talk to each other. Oh, do they talk to each other?
That was a question I must have to revisit next time. I love that mushroom, and it’s pretty. It’s a pretty mushroom, too.
It’s really cool looking, but you would never experience it. It’s really meaty. Can you eat some of these as we go on here?
A lot of people take them in powder form, but can you cook with a lot of mushrooms we’re talking about right now?
[Speaker 1]
Lion’s mane, definitely. It’s considered a choice edible by some people. A lot of people love eating lion’s mane.
In fact, I think Whole Foods regularly sells it now. Places like that should be able to find it at a local farmer’s market. There are some cordyceps cultivators that put some recipes and some cooking ideas out with cordyceps.
I personally haven’t tried it just because of how difficult and expensive the cordyceps is to cultivate compared to some of these other mushrooms. And I don’t know. I’ve always just thought of it more as medicine and not so much as food.
And when you find cordyceps in the wild, you tend to find very, very small amounts of it. Like the cordyceps militaris, that’s one of the popular cordyceps to take medicinally. Your average specimen is going to be about the size of your pinky finger.
And on a hike, you may find one, maybe two of those. So you’re not going to find a sufficient amount for it to be a food source. Chaga, because of the texture, a lot of people will take it as powder or make it into a tea or a coffee substitute.
But I wouldn’t think that would be one that you could cook or eat with.
[Speaker 2]
There’s a lot of benefits to chaga though, right?
[Speaker 1]
There’s a lot. Absolutely. And chaga, I think on, well, a lot of people for a long time now have referred to chaga as the king of medicinal mushrooms.
And again, we use that term immunomodulator earlier. Chaga is another really strong one. And a lot of people bring it into focus when they’re working with things like HIV or even as an adjunct to some cancer treatments, if they’re dealing with cancer.
And it tends to be kind of energizing too. And in a way that people say feels more organic than say, a caffeine boost, you don’t get as much of that initial kind of rush and then sort of the equal crash when it wears off. It’s a little more natural feeling energy boost.
And it’s not as well studied, unfortunately, as some of these other medicinals. But you can look at the studies that have been done and a lot of the knowledge in the herbalist community over the years and some of the indigenous communities that have used chaga. And it’s certainly one of my favorites.
And I consider it a powerhouse for sure.
[Speaker 2]
Me too. I like lion’s mane and chaga. And now we have our reishi.
That’s the sleep component. Is that the sleep mushroom?
[Speaker 1]
It can be. One of the interesting properties about reishi is it’s what they would consider a true adaptogen. And an adaptogen being something that helps you adapt primarily to stress.
People consider cordyceps an adaptogen, but typically an energizing adaptogen just because of the energy boosting effects that it has. Something like reishi, it’s more of a true adaptogen where if you tend to utilize it maybe in the earlier part of your day, you’re going to notice that it helps with your energy and brings you into focus and kind of brings you into the day. But then if you use it in the evening or at night, it will have that sort of calming effect and help you with more of a sleep mindset or a focus on relaxation.
[Speaker 2]
I love that so much. And then we have our turkey tails, right? Turkey tail.
That’s really not too popular or common out there, but it is becoming.
[Speaker 1]
Yeah, and that one doesn’t have as much of an effect on, say, your mental state or your emotions, stress or anxiety. But from an immune perspective, it’s possibly one of the most powerful. It’s probably the first one that people would recommend when it comes to treating a lot of cancers or as an adjunct to any cancer treatments that are being done.
And it’s also really good at fighting inflammation to just sort of generalized inflammation throughout the body, which is such a core component of so many conditions and illnesses and problems that folks deal with today.
[Speaker 2]
I’m going to get up a little bit of a side swing here, but then you have all these other kinds of edible mushrooms that we’re all really familiar with, like the portabellas and the bellas and all these. So there’s no medicinal values to them, is there?
[Speaker 1]
Oh, absolutely. With the majority of the mushrooms that you’re going to consume as edibles, there’s the immediate benefit of just fiber, good dietary fiber. But those, the portabellas and the white mushrooms, the baby portabellas, all of those are really high in a lot of B vitamins.
A lot of mushrooms have vitamin D, which, you know, it’s really tough to find non-animal sources of vitamin D, but boom, your mushrooms have it. Even those baby bellas from the grocery store. They, in fact, have a lot of that same kind of immunomodulation effect that we talked about with some of these other medicinal mushrooms.
So there really are some health benefits to eating those, provided you are getting the ones that you know are organically cultivated, because otherwise you’re taking a healthy thing and then covering it in pesticides and all the problems that come along with that.
[Speaker 2]
Yeah. Let’s definitely circle back around everything here because that’s what we’re going to come back to next. So we talk about taking these supplements.
Here’s one thing I noticed. I notice more when I don’t take the mushroom than when I do. Now, there’s a lot of new, I don’t know, call them gimmicks or things or stuff coming out like coffees.
What is your belief around the coffees? Because they’re so mixed. How do you know what you’re getting and what you’re not getting?
Are they mixing them all correctly? Because RISE has just risen. They’re like the new Folgers.
It really is out there. RISE is, I mean, to me, I actually kind of do like RISE coffee, but am I fully getting all these great benefits? How am I knowing what I’m getting?
I mean, there’s a lot of questions that I’m asking, but you know, is that the right way to do it or is it not? I don’t know.
[Speaker 1]
In my opinion, the mushroom coffees, RISE is an example. If it helps somebody that’s a coffee drinker or has a caffeine habit, if it helps them as a substitute or they just want to enjoy it as a beverage, I think that’s great. But I personally would have two concerns.
One, historically, mushroom powders, especially if you buy them in bulk from a manufacturer or you’re not sure of the sourcing, there’s been issues with mushroom powders with everything from them just being stuffed with filler to not being the mushroom they claim to be to the mushrooms were grown somewhere where heavy metals are a concern and the mushrooms test positive for heavy metals. So if you’re not certain of the sourcing, that’s an issue. And then the other point that you just made, which is how do you know that the dosages of these mushrooms that are in these coffees are, you know, potentially that they’re not too strong or more importantly, that they’re not strong enough.
I mean, if there’s just little tiny bits of each one of these mushrooms, just so that they can say they’re in there, are you really going to get the benefit from that? Probably not.
[Speaker 2]
Yeah. And I did. You brought up something to wean yourself off the coffee.
I take the RISE and mix it with my coffee. So I was asking myself, am I really getting the benefits from this coffee? Because, you know, we’re going to come up with a coffee sooner or later with your help, I guarantee it.
And let’s talk about dosages then. What is the right dose? Let’s start with Lion’s Mane because that’s really popular.
I think a lot of people start taking Lion’s Mane. But, you know, where’s the dosage at? Where should you start?
[Speaker 1]
You mentioned 500 milligrams earlier as an adjunct to taking some of the other mushrooms, and that’s usually the starting dose I recommend. The therapeutic dose can go as high as three grams dried or the equivalent per day. But there’s not necessarily a reason to do that if you’re just looking to introduce yourself to the mushroom or see what it can offer you or you’re not, you know, treating a condition that would benefit from that large of a dose.
[Speaker 2]
Let me give us an example of a condition where somebody would eat that amount.
[Speaker 1]
If you were dealing with some sort of traumatic injury that had a neurological component, be it to brain or even another part of your body, that’s one example. Even some instances where, say, somebody might be in a coma, the Lion’s Mane may have a stimulating effect at higher doses and get some neurological activity going again. But traumatic injuries, neurological conditions, say, where nerves have been damaged or myelin might be missing.
You know, myself, when I was dealing with the post-anesthesia brain fog, that’s another instance where a higher dose might be warranted and you might see some benefits from it. But the main thing that people have reported to me, if they go a little bit higher on the dose than they want to, is just a feeling of kind of restlessness and not being able to sleep because the nerves are maybe a little too active.
[Speaker 2]
I mean, the science is there. Lion’s Mane does build new neurotransmitters, correct? Correct.
Or am I wrong by saying that? They do. Oh, absolutely.
Just like psilocybin builds new neurotransmitters, right? Yeah. So why are we, why are we, I mean, it just baffles me.
I ask myself why. I kick myself in the ass just by saying why. I know why we don’t do these things because they don’t want us healthy.
So, you know, when we think of this and, I mean, think about like Alzheimer’s or, you know, maybe, I don’t know, I can go up with a lot of these brain, but why are we using these medicines? It just baffles me that we’re not at these higher dosages. Because like you say, I think higher dosage, you’re going to know, I mean, you might get the runs, you might get cramping stomach, but you’re not going to die, right?
Are you going to die from any of these questions we’re mentioning? Definitely not. No.
So Reishi, we talked about Reishi on the higher level. What would you stick with around there? 250?
500?
[Speaker 1]
You know, 500 is not a bad dose for that one either. Somebody that I respect a lot, who’s got quite a bit of experience in the functional mushroom space, his recommendation is a gram a day, dried or the equivalent. But again, you know, 500 milligrams is a good starting dosage to meet the mushroom, see what it has to offer you, you know, just introduce yourself to it.
[Speaker 2]
So about the 500 to 1000 gram range for all these things would be pretty good for people. So where is this gone? I mean, why are we doing, why are we utilizing this more?
You know, I think it is, I think it’s finally coming to a little bit of the surface. I think people are definitely not trusting the Western world medicine as much as they used to. And, you know, like I said before, I think people, you know, we’re not, they’re not getting that, like that Xanax feeling like, oh, okay, that worked for me because I just took it.
But you know what, with mushrooms, it’s like when you are taking them, it’s when you stop taking them. But, you know, it’s really hard to hmm, generating people’s mind because they want this quick fix, you know.
[Speaker 1]
And it’s true. And I’ve, I’ve both experienced and said that very same thing to people, which is, you know, when I take my mushroom supplements, especially my lion’s man and my cordyceps, when I take them every day, I maybe don’t notice so much. But if I forget, or I stop taking them for three or four days, I absolutely notice that I’m not taking them.
[Speaker 2]
For sure. For sure. And let’s take into like mushrooms and things.
There’s a whole, like we have our psilocybin mushrooms. We have these, you use these more technological words than I do. We have these adaptogen mushrooms.
Is that what you would call these more adaptogens?
[Speaker 1]
The Reishi, the cordyceps, honestly, I would consider all the ones we’ve discussed adaptogens just because there is some sort of effect on the mood and the brain in every single one we’ve discussed. Maybe not the turkey tail, but the big four, the lion’s mane, the Reishi, the Chaga, the cordyceps for sure.
[Speaker 2]
Yeah. And then you’ve got these edible mushrooms that are all over the place. And then you really got mushrooms that will kill you, right?
They will absolutely kill you. Like there’s a mushroom now that’s really, you know, I’m not a big fan of it. And we can talk about it a little bit.
I didn’t want to really go this far, but we will, but an amaretto mascara mushroom. Okay. This mushroom really kind of poisonous, not consumed in the right way, but it’s absolutely legal in all our 50 states, which is, I don’t know how you feel about this mushroom.
How do you feel about it?
[Speaker 1]
I feel that it does have a very niche and limited medicinal use if it’s properly prepared. But I think right now, because it’s 50 states legal, it is being marketed by a lot of people that want to make money from it. It’s being misrepresented as an equivalent to the psilocybin mushroom, which it is in no way, shape or form such a thing, not, not, not even close.
And, and again, that one, the Amanita muscaria isn’t one of the Amanita’s that can kill you fortunately, but you can get quite, quite, quite sick from it. If your dosage isn’t regulated. And like you said, if it’s not properly prepared when I see all the different ways that it’s being offered right now, everything from, you know, gummies to teas, so they’ve got it in vapes now and just stuff like that.
It, it makes me a bit nervous because of how it’s being misused and that eventually it probably will have some legal controls established. The one thing that it’s been great for in my experience is that it works on the same receptor system as drugs like Xanax and Valium and Ativan. And I’ve been able to use it to help wean people off those medicines and ultimately not need anything of the sort.
But again, you’re looking at a controlled dosage over a very finite amount of time in a super specific use case. Personally, I’m not super happy with the way that it’s being marketed and sold and used right now.
[Speaker 2]
I’m not either because you look at psilocybin that you’d have to consume 26 pounds to even come close to death, but you could really die on that Emery DeMosquero. You know, you could actually really die and it’s legal in 50 states and you nailed it. They are marketing this mushroom as totally false.
[Speaker 1]
I mean, it’s totally false. I mean, I can’t even see the logic in that other than, you know, the product of, or the idea of, well, this’ll probably get people really high. And if it gets people really high, we can make money from it.
And right now it’s legal. So let’s do this.
[Speaker 2]
That’s definitely not the route we’re going. We want to get people, you know, we want to make people help people to understand that their own guru, that their own, they can heal themselves through, you know, some of these simple processes or some of these daily practices, or just really creating a relationship with mushrooms or medicine, or let it be kratom or whatever I’m not a big fan of kratom, but you know what? It helps a lot of people.
If you can become relationships with some of these medicines, it makes things so much easier. And it makes it, it almost brings everything together, you know, because mushrooms have been around and we can definitely hop into this for sure. Mushrooms has been around for a really long time.
And just during the span of about the last 40 years, have we told people that you’re going to jump off buildings? You’re going to commit suicide. You’re going to kill yourself.
I’ve never seen that happen ever, but I’ve never seen even on 10, 20 gram journeys, I’ve never seen anything like that happen because it won’t happen. It won’t maybe PCP or things of that nature. But, you know, we’re talking about a mushroom that has been given to us from the earth that actually has come from the earth.
That actually is dinosaur DNA. That’s alien DNA, that whatever DNA has risen, it’s soil, right? It’s soil is what it is.
It’s been here for a long time and we just demonized it. Or we did it. Pharmaceutical has.
Pretty crazy, huh?
[Speaker 1]
It baffles me. I mean, and I agree with you that I think more and more people are starting to see that Western medicine isn’t offering solutions. You know, it keeps you just well enough to keep going and just sick enough to keep going back.
And as more and more people want to really get healthy and find solutions, people are finding mushrooms. And I think it’s a beautiful, beautiful thing.
[Speaker 2]
You know, this is a true statement. Pfizer hasn’t been around for 176 years. Pfizer, they’ve been around for 176 years.
And you never know. You know, they’ve never cured one disease, not one. They haven’t cured one.
And it’s pretty, pretty insane that we still trust these people, you know, pretty insane, you know, because we’ve been like we’ve been doing this for a long time. You know, our people, yeah, I can go back to the pyramids. You know, these things weren’t built by us.
You know, they were built by something. But this is just crazy. You know, so we’ve been doing these and they find all these replicas.
I mean, we got we talk about the Bible and how the Bible came about and how the story of the Bible came about. If you look at every story in the Bible, once they consume their sacrament, which their sacrament was the Acacia tree. So the Acacia tree is full of DMT.
Now they have these huge experiences. Every single freaking experience they had came from psychedelic journeys. You cannot tell me not.
Okay. You just don’t walk on water. You don’t have two animals come on arcs.
They’re all visions of the future, you know, and it all comes to the same story. It all comes to love yourself and to be this person. It’s just the baffling that we’ve created these visions and these stories and we don’t tell people the real truth about them.
Sorry, I get a little passionate and off the chain there, but it’s the truth. I mean, these things are written like this. You come up with another one, like AA, Alcoholics Anonymous, founded by Bill Wilson, who discovered Alcoholics Anonymous through a psychedelic journey.
But bring up this anybody to a lifelong AA, they’ll tell you you’re nuts. See, we’re here to bring people the truth. And the truth is these medicines really work.
They don’t work hard to educate you. In some way, shape, or form, they could be hurtful. But what is your whole thinking about all this?
What do you feel, man? Do you hear me? Oh, there you are.
Yeah. What do you feel about all this? What do you feel about where we’re going and what we’re doing?
How do you feel? Because you’ve been in this space, you’ve been especially in the functional medicine space for a little while now. What do you feel?
[Speaker 1]
I really resonate with a lot of what you just said. The acacia tree, especially, not only was that one of their medicines in the biblical times, but that symbolism has persisted even today into the higher orders of things like Freemasonry. You see the symbolism of the acacia tree coming up again and again and again.
And there’s a few of us that go to various alchemy conferences and discussions, and we absolutely are well aware of what that means and why that symbolism has been carried forward. And I think that these mushrooms, these medicines, just even these functional mushrooms, not necessarily things like the acacia tree or the psilocybin mushrooms, were put here for the same reasons as sentient creatures that we have an ability to communicate with on multiple levels. I think there are reasons that we live in such symbiosis with these mushrooms, that we’re able to find them and cultivate them, and that so many of them are at home in our bodies and offer these amazing health benefits to us.
And I think it’s unfortunate that a lot of people have had to undergo the health crises they have and see the system of Western medicine ultimately fail them. But one thing that’s kept me going for as long as I’ve been doing this is knowing that I’ve been a small part of the solution, even if it’s just me and just a handful of people that I’ve been able to introduce to these medicines. I feel great about that.
And to this day, I love being a part of this space and being able to spread the message and spread that medicine.
[Speaker 2]
Like I tell Matt, and yeah, that’s why we really resonated, because I’m the same way. You know, this is like, I don’t want to get emotional, but this is such a simple process. It’s so simple.
And, you know, people want to dive into this insurance and this, and I want to do this. You know, why don’t we start simple? Well, start with some mushrooms, start with 500, you know, see how you start feeling, you know, there’s some movement here.
I’ve never seen something like this. And, you know, it is all around the mushroom for me. I mean, maybe because I’m just in that world, but, you know, a lot of people are talking about the mushrooms, not even psilocybin, psychedelic.
They’re just talking in general about the mushrooms, you know, and we need to educate them. We really do. Like some of the things I talked to you about this morning, I’m really rethinking about the rice coffee because is it, is it really helping me?
You know, is it, you know, I’m thinking maybe it is, but, you know, there are, there are, there are ways to really do this and really ways to really get help you. Let’s go and talk about how we can add some psilocybin to those ways, like lion’s mane and psilocybin. Great combination or what?
[Speaker 1]
Amazing combination. They, they work incredibly well together because they’re both at least on a physiological level, they’re, they’re, they’re kind of doing the same thing. They’re seeing where there’s nerves that maybe a neural pathway doesn’t exist, and there could be one or some nerves have been damaged and need to be repaired as much as lion’s mane can kind of do it on its own.
And psilocybin can kind of do it on its own when you put them together. It’s, it’s, it’s not even an additive kind of effect. It’s more of an exponential effect in terms of what it can do to help people heal.
And, you know, it can help with just mood and anxiety stuff. It can help with PTSD related things. Again, if you’re dealing with traumatic injuries or brain fog post anesthesia, I personally can’t say enough good things about that particular combination.
[Speaker 2]
It is. It’s a, it’s a beautiful combination, low dosage. Microdosing is a beautiful combination.
Microdosing is a very beneficial. If anybody’s thinking about starting, mom and those is the place to start, but it’s just, it’s such, like, I think it alleviates a few things in life for us. It alleviates that brain fog and that monkey mind and that anxiety.
So now we can kind of become an alignment. You know, there’s a little, we talk on these, like, I think we talked before about this, or I’ve talked about this a lot, but when we do these psychedelic journeys, these bigger journeys, you know, whether it be with mushrooms or ayahuasca or whatever plant that we do these psychedelic journeys with, you know, it’s just a few couple of short hours of a fantasy world for us. You know, it’s like some scary, some not, maybe bliss, maybe not, but you know, just a few short hours.
It’s opening up those portals afterwards. Now we’re filling it up with these good things. You know, a lot of people don’t know how to do that, but you know, if we can fill them up with the lion’s mane, the reishi, the thoughts, you know, we have to, you’re opening up portals to fill them back up, you know, and it’s what psychodonts do.
They’re just, they are beautiful way to not only heal your mental health, but your physical health, because without both, you’re just, I mean, remember my monkey mind and I just, to this day, sometimes it doesn’t stop, but you know, it’s really helped through psychedelics for sure. You know, and I have to say mushrooms have contributed wholeheartedly to that. And, you know, I don’t think people like me and you and so many people that are passionate about this space coming out, you know, Paul’s probably the fastest time, but you know, 10 years ago, Paul should be here now.
And I think there’s a big movement in the next 10 years too, where these things are going to be on everybody’s shelf and it’s going to be working. And, you know, we’re going to put the big F you to big pharma who’s been fucking us for a long time. And that’s not my goal because I think big pharma does have some benefits.
You know, I think Western medicine does have some benefits when you come to a heart attack or breaking an arm or a leg, when it comes to mental health, I think they really fooled us.
[Speaker 1]
Agreed. And honestly, even some more of the, the systemic stuff, that’s a little harder to generalize and treat, you know, something that doesn’t have a concrete physical solution, like, oh, unblock this vessel. We fix the heart attack, set this bone, we fix the fracture.
A lot of the systemic stuff, Western medicine’s not so great at either. And a lot of people are realizing, Hey, we’ve heard great things about some of these functional mushrooms and they might be able to help us with this too.
[Speaker 2]
You know, if not, why not give it a try? You know, I mean, it’s happening and the movement’s here and I’m glad that we have met. I’m really, really glad that you like reached out and I reached out to you.
And, you know, I think our connection is going to work really well because I think the biggest, I mean, to me and Michelle and to our team and Mama Dose that I think the biggest thing we need to do is educate people. I don’t care about anything else. Once you educate them, then they’re well on their way.
Then they know better. You know? I mean, once somebody has that first psychedelic journey, they’re like, that was it.
That was it. That’s what they told me I was going to do. It’s just bizarre.
It’s just bizarre. And you’re like, yeah, that was it. Now go love yourself.
It’s pretty cool. You know? So I just like all this.
I really do. So we’ll end it here in a little bit. We’re definitely going to have you discussing a lot more things coming up in the future.
That’s for sure. Let’s just talk about when we end here, what you would recommend for people to start taking, to start off with? What would you recommend?
[Speaker 1]
I have said for years that I think every person alive should be taking Lion’s Mane. I think anybody out there should start with 500 milligram daily Lion’s Mane capsule or the equivalent and just see what it can do for you. Meet that mushroom, introduce that medicine to your body.
Because I don’t think I have met anyone yet that’s tried Lion’s Mane as medicine working with me that hasn’t noticed some benefit from it. And some of the other ones maybe are a little more niche or maybe not for everybody. Although I think a lot of people are curious and could probably benefit from most of them.
But anybody that’s remotely curious looking for something that could really help you, something that comes with virtually no risk to try it, that Lion’s Mane.
[Speaker 2]
Me too. I think that’s been a powerhouse. Do you think there’s a difference between the tinctures or the capsules?
Because tinctures are popular too.
[Speaker 1]
Tinctures were really popular for a long time. I think I’ve seen tinctures falling out of favor, especially with some folks that are younger than either one of us are, just because there’s sort of a general feeling towards avoiding alcohol. I think tinctures are maybe the next best thing if you don’t have access to just a good quality source of the mushrooms.
And I absolutely know that the medicine y’all make is just that. We’ve discussed where you get them from and who cultivates them. But the closer you can get to consuming the whole mushroom or the whole plant, in my opinion, the better.
You’re just going to be more in harmony with that mushroom or that plant. You’re going to make sure you’re getting every single beneficial compound that’s in it. And quite frankly, most people probably don’t get enough fiber in their diet.
And if you’re consuming the actual mushroom itself, you’re going to get that fiber too. And that’s never a bad thing.
[Speaker 2]
For sure. Absolutely. Younger generations are going to really move this movement.
I feel. I feel the younger generations really in tune with psychedelics. I feel they’re really in tune with holistical healing.
I don’t think they like the Western world medicine. So I think they’re our best friend moving forward. You know, and a lot of them, a lot of them are steering away from alcohol.
You know, it’s something that the Western world really glorifies. And it’s the biggest poison out there. It’s the biggest killer by far.
I mean, it is the biggest drug bar none. And they glorify it like it’s going out of style because people are afraid to face themselves. So they have to drink alcohol.
And I think the younger generation is really going to push a big movement in the next 20 years. You know, this is a 20 year movement. I think in the next 20, you’re going to see they ain’t even going to look the same.
Good stuff. Yeah. Well, Matt, I’m going to really welcome.
See if we can definitely be welcoming to the team soon. I think you’re going to be a really, really good asset for us. A mom of those team, a mom of functional mushrooms.
I think I think we’re on the right path here. And, you know, our goal is to educate and inform people. And, you know, that’s what we’re here for.
Anything you want to end with?
[Speaker 1]
I just wanted to say thanks again to you and Michelle and the team for having me on today and for for the opportunity and really looking forward to working with you guys and getting the word out to people about mom of those and about these functionals.
[Speaker 2]
Yeah, these functionals are going to be something else. You know, we really want to inform these people. We really want to educate.
And thank you, Matt. I really, really, really the team resonates with you. So thank you much.
Thank you, guys.
